Guest, Personality

Guset：Naoki Matsuura

Currently active as an animation director, director, and animation creator

Member of the Japan Animation Association

Born in Tokyo in 1982, currently residing in Kanagawa Prefecture. Graduated from the Department of Imaging Arts and Sciences at Musashino Art University in 2006.

After working as a production assistant at Polygon Pictures, Production I.G, and ROBOT, among others, he became independent. He has experience in producing various types of visual and animated content, including TV, commercials, music videos, exhibitions, and live visuals. In 2016, he directed the exhibition video for the Japan Pavilion at the Milan Expo, and the project won a gold medal at the Expo. His first work as an animation director for a commercial project was the “Marukome Miso Animation CM.” Since then, he has also worked on storyboarding and directing TV series animations.

In 2016, he conducted crowdfunding for his original short film “Hizukuri,” raising over 1.7 million yen. The film was completed in 2021 and has been screened at events, distributed online, and submitted to film festivals, receiving nominations and awards both domestically and internationally.

In 2023, he directed the TV anime “Liar Liar.” Currently, he is directing a feature-length animated film scheduled for release in 2024.

Personality: Yuuki Sakoda

After working for a telecommunications company and a comprehensive advertising agency, he started an anime planning and production company and produces music videos and films. In 2021, he moved to Kyoto and started working on promoting the entertainment industry in Kyoto. He is currently also working in the entertainment field of manga and audio. He is planning and producing audio dramas and webtoons. In addition, he serves as a producer and advisor for multiple entertainment companies.

---

A elementary school student who dreams of becoming a manga artist, and loved the long-running series Doraemon.

Sakoda

Yes, welcome. Nice to meet you. Thank you in advance.

Matsuura

Yes, it is an honor to be called.

Sakoda

Thank you very much. Today, I would like to hear various stories from Matsuura-san, but in advance I have received topic notes from Matsuura-san.

Matsuura

Like a mandala… (laughs).

Sakoda

That book is really like a mandala, with episodes from various eras scattered in various places. While receiving the memo, I would like to hear stories from places like elementary school, middle school, and high school, which have become catalysts for your current career, as well as things you are currently doing and things you are struggling with. I would also like to hear about the creative philosophy that emerged from those experiences, as well as your current thoughts.

First, as a guide, I would like to read aloud your profile to understand the career path you have taken, Matsura-san. Would that be okay?

Matsuura

Yes. Please.

Guset：Naoki Matsuura

Animation director, director, and animation writer actively working.

Member of the Japan Animation Association.

Born in Tokyo in 1982, currently residing in Kanagawa Prefecture.Graduated from Musashino Art University’s Department of Film and Video in 2006.After working as a production coordinator at Polycon Pictures, Production IG, ROBOT…, etc., became independent.Experienced various video and animation productions such as TV, commercials, music videos, exhibitions, and live visuals.In 2016, was in charge of directing the exhibition video at the Japan Pavilion of the Milan Expo, and the project won a gold award at the Expo.As an animation director for commercial works, the “Marukome Miso Anime CM” was the first one.Continued to work as a storyboard artist and director for TV series anime.

In 2016, conducted a crowdfunding campaign for the original short film “Hidzukuri.”With support exceeding 1.7 million yen, it was completed in 2021.Screened at events, distributed online, and nominated and awarded domestically and internationally at film festivals.

Will serve as director for the TV anime “Liar Liar” scheduled to air in 2023.Currently working as director for a theatrical animation scheduled for release in 2024.

Sakoda

This is not busy, is it?

Matsuura

Ah, thanks to you, yes (laughs). I’ve been able to do various things.

Sakoda

By the way, how are you feeling right now? It’s already getting closer to autumn in 2023, though.

Matsuura

Well, yeah. There are various things happening in the world, but I hope for peace (laughs). It’s getting off topic though (laughs). Okay, so what should we do? Should we talk about stories from childhood or the past?

Sakoda

People who quickly hear my current profile might wonder, “How do you create original works?” or “How do you raise money?” So, I think it would be good to briefly talk about the path I took before heading there, and then go into detail on those topics as the main course.

Also, I have some really interesting episodes from my joke memo. Is it okay if I extract some of them and share?

Matsuura

Yes, that’s how it is.

Sakoda

Yes, when you were in elementary school, your dream was to become a manga artist, influenced by ‘Doraemon.’ I think you watched the movies too, but the manga version was like my bible, wasn’t it?

Matsuura

I think it’s called a long series, you know, that movie by Fujiko F. Fujio that was turned into a manga while he was still alive. I believe it was serialized in magazines like CoroCoro in separate parts. And well, each part was eventually compiled into a tankobon.

So, of course, I also like the short episodes, but there are tankobon volumes where the original version of those movies is turned into a manga. I’ve been buying and collecting them to read.

Sakoda

The other works that were seen include ‘Dragon Ball’, ‘Hero Robot’, ‘Akia’, and ‘Ghost in the Shell’…

Matsuura

Well, umm, yeah. It’s kind of cheesy, but yeah. In elementary and middle school, it was all about “Dragon Ball”, but it wasn’t in real-time. My dad used to watch the anime of “Akira” on video, and I was like, “What is this?” You know, those last scenes, they were so shocking, I had never seen anything like that before. And then, I got so disgusted that I couldn’t eat pizza for a while.

Anyway, I knew about it, but I didn’t really know what kind of work it was. But after the shock, I became interested and started buying some manga volumes with my limited allowance, and I was like, “Ah, so this is the kind of manga that exists.” And from there, I got deeply immersed in “Akira”. Well, as I mentioned in that memo, there was a catchphrase in the movie trailer in New York or something that said “Violent and beautiful”. And I thought, “Wow, how can something be violent but beautiful? But yeah, ‘Akira’ is like that.”

I used to love “Doraemon” and was always in a happy-go-lucky world, but I can certainly say that it’s “violent and beautiful”. It’s not just about good triumphing over evil, but I was really drawn to the words “violent but beautiful”. So, there was a kind of turning point. I started buying and reading the manga by Otomo-san, starting from there.

Sakoda

“Doraemon” can be surprisingly ironic, and when you watch it as an adult, you realize there are things you can take in from it. But still, there’s “Akira” and other works like “Parasyte” that I’m also into…

Matsuura

Yes, “Parasyte” is like that too, right? “Parasyte” was also shocking, truly a bible. I’ve read it dozens of times and there are so many memorable scenes, but you know, there’s a part where Migi fights Gotou and dies once. There are many other memorable scenes, but there’s one where Shinichi and Migi argue about whether to kill or not kill the parasitic organisms, and Migi asks Shinichi, “What would you do if our positions were reversed?”

And then Shinichi is like, “Hmm” and starts to ponder. And then there’s Migi’s monologue that goes, “He hesitates when I say this. This is what it means to be a human.” And I thought, “Ah, I see.” It means that as humans, we can imagine putting ourselves in someone else’s shoes, right? It’s a really profound scene that gives a lot of implications. So going through moments like that, “Parasyte” is well, a bible, even now.

Story of the Little Person Inside My Stomach: “My Original Experience with Implicit Understanding”

Sakoda

The scene that left an impression on me in Mr. Matsura’s “Parasyte” is the underlying message that I can still feel. For example, it was something that was written during “The Droplet of Humanity,” I believe. It was about a boy who accepts the world’s unwritten rules and there was a story like “My original experience regarding the tacit understanding is written in the book.” I think it was mentioned in the book.

Matsuura

Ah, yes. Oh, you’ve read that too. I’m honored.

Sakoda

Hmm, it’s really interesting. In other words, how should I put it… it might become a bit complicated, but within the trend of interpreting the world in a deductive way, there are quite a few instances where people have certain assumptions and then just stop thinking. It’s not like humans are poisoned by that kind of thinking, but I wonder if there’s no antithesis to that. When I thought about whether there might be a motif for that, I realized that this Migi character is observing humans from a bird’s-eye view and becoming interested in how humans think, like “Ah, so this is how humans think.” The world, or rather society, is presented to us as something ordinary, but why do we only look at it head-on?

I found it quite interesting when Matsura-san referred to the “world’s conventions” in his book. I also empathize with the theme quite a bit. Why does everyone say that we should think in this way? That’s why Parasyte is also fascinating, because it explores completely different thought processes when people, or rather the alien Migi, who come from different cultures, customs, and value systems, work towards the same goal.

So, I think that kind of motif is always present in Matsura-san’s works. That’s what I thought while listening to the story of “Parasyte” now.

Matsuura

Thank you for analyzing it deeply. Well, regarding the discussion about my graduation project, the original experience was based on a picture book I read in kindergarten. The book depicted little people living inside a human body, tidying up the food. As a child, I believed in it wholeheartedly, thinking that there really were little people inside me.

Then, when I entered elementary school, around second or third grade, I casually asked my mother while she was cooking in the kitchen, “Oh, by the way, do little people really exist?” She replied, “Oh, that? It’s just a lie.” That became the original experience for my work “Hito Shizuku” (Human Droplet), but it made me realize that there are many things like that. It wasn’t a rebellious feeling of being deceived or lied to by adults, but rather, it felt like a puzzle piece descending from above and fitting into place within myself.

To put it in simpler terms, it’s similar to Santa Claus, isn’t it? I genuinely believed in Santa Claus and even got into arguments with friends about it (laughs). Well, realistically speaking, those parents are giving children dreams. But you know, it’s not like someone decides when it has to be revealed. Eventually, everyone realizes on their own, “Oh, it was my mom and dad who did it, they lied for me.” That kind of change in mindset at that moment is interesting. It became the starting point, or rather, the theme for my graduation project.

Sakoda

It seems that everyone intuitively feels the change in their heart, but it feels like there aren’t many people who try to capture those emotions by putting a peg in it. Isn’t that something that just quietly passes by, like “Oh, I see”?

Matsuura

Yes, it’s a story that would end with something like “Yeah, that’s right” or so.

Sakoda

There is a puzzle called “Adapting to Society” where the pieces keep falling from the top, giving you a sense that the puzzle is coming together. That’s how I interpreted it in my own way. But you know, adults casually say things about the “truth of the world and society” without any innocence…

By the way, I wonder if this book was sold at events like Comiket when Mr. Matsuura created “Fire Making”?

Matsuura

Oh no, I didn’t make it to sell as a crowdfunding reward. I think I only made about 150 copies. And now, more than half of them are still in stock at my place… (laughs).

Sakoda

No, this is an extremely interesting book, so I hope it will be released to the world.

Matsuura

Well, I was thinking that if there was an opportunity, I might sell it or something. The inventory is completely stored in our closet.

Inspired by Osamu Tezuka’s Buddha, a middle school student.

Sakoda

The story you just told me about the little person in Matsumura-san’s stomach was his experience of implicit understanding. When you talk about this episode, the written text itself becomes quite vivid. For example, “My mother casually said it was a lie and continued cooking with a rhythmic chopping sound.” I find the motif of this rhythmic sound and the daily life it represents quite intriguing, which I think connects to other works by Matsumura-san and, of course, the upcoming “Fire Making” story. It’s very memorable.

This sound, the rhythmic chopping sound of my mother cutting things in the kitchen, is also something that symbolizes my childhood experience. I find this expression very interesting.

Matsuura

Well, my friends and my wife have been helping me edit the text in that area. I wrote the original text quickly, with the intention of making it an interesting read, but the basic structure was diligently put together by those two. It’s really thanks to them.

Sakoda

Since the language of the user’s text is not clear, I will translate it into English.

This is a really good article, so if there is an opportunity for it to be published somewhere, please have everyone read it. And, I’m sorry, as expected, let’s start talking about elementary and middle school and it’s really modern…

Matsuura

Ah, I got carried away with my work, didn’t I? (laughs)

Sakoda

Well, I think it’s also good to go back again, but in junior high school, “AKIRA” and “Parasyte” became bibles in that sense, and Osamu Tezuka’s “Buddha” was also added there.

Matsuura

“Buddha” was also quite shocking, right? So, you know, middle school students tend to think about various things like that.

Sakoda

I was pretty absent-minded, you know (laughs).

Matsuura

Oh, really? (laughs) In my family, neither my father nor my mother follows a specific religion, so we didn’t have anything like that. However, we had a statue of “Buddha” at home, and I started reading it casually. I don’t remember which volume it was, but there was a scene where I realized that there is a god inside people’s hearts. I remember that scene vividly. I thought, “Ah, so there is a god inside our hearts.” At that time, I was deeply moved and excited, so I happily told my friends in the baseball club, “There is a god inside people’s hearts!” But they just replied, “Oh, really?” with a weak reaction. I thought, “Hmm, maybe not everyone thinks about these things.” I didn’t have many friends who would talk about such topics, so it was quite rare for me to have those conversations.

Sakoda

Being a middle school student is just like that, you know (laughs).

Matsuura

So, I think I might have been seen as a weird guy from an outsider’s perspective.

Sakoda

Somehow, it depends on the era, but I think for me, it was probably “Dragon Ball” or “Slam Dunk” and stuff like that. Well, you can learn about life and various things from those works, but you can also grasp a deeper aspect, you know, when you touch manga like “Parasyte” or “Buddha” or “AKIRA”.

Matsuura

Well, you’re right. Even if you read “AKIRA” for the first time, it’s really hard to understand the translation. They’re currently holding a cel animation exhibition, and I went to see it the other day. I watched the movie again and reread the manga, and it’s still the truth, what’s depicted there.

The amount of information contained in the anime “AKIRA” contributes to the current anime production?

Sakoda

In this podcast, many of the guests are involved in creating anime. However, most of them have originally grown up reading manga. Regarding the discussion about “AKIRA” earlier, I was wondering, when Mr. Matsuura first encountered “AKIRA,” was it through the anime or the manga?

Matsuura

First, it was an anime, right? The movie version.

Sakoda

I think the impact when anime became a visual medium was incredible. Even if you were originally someone who read manga and was familiar with the works, the increase in information when it became animated was amazing, don’t you think? So, I think there were moments of great surprise or shock in that aspect.

And perhaps, the experiences you felt around that time have brought you here as someone who creates anime. I was wondering if it has something to do with the fact that you are now making anime instead of manga, what do you think?

Matsuura

Looks like it’s Geinou Yamashiro-gumi’s music, right? It’s loud. I have no idea what that is either. What the heck is this? (laughs)

At that time, I had very little allowance, so I bought soundtracks and stuff. In interviews, Otomo-san would talk about how he thought about and did certain things. At first, he wanted to ask the Geinou Yamashirogumi group if they could use their past works for “AKIRA”, so he went to negotiate. It turned out that the Geinou Yamashirogumi group were also big fans of “AKIRA” and had read it.

The idea was not to say “Make a movie and then make a soundtrack,” but rather “First, there is the music of ‘AKIRA’ as a standalone entity, and then there is an animated movie that comes after, and we would like to use the original music for that,” and he explained it like that. I thought, “Oh, I see.” It was here that I learned about negotiating with musicians and such. The impact of having music playing in a futuristic city like in “Kaneda” is definitely something. Later, I found out that after watching “AKIRA,” I watched “Blade Runner,” so for those who watched “Blade Runner” first, they might say that “AKIRA” is a copy or a rip-off. Some people criticize it, but since I saw “AKIRA” first.

That music is definitely unique to “AKIRA,” isn’t it? Combining that kind of music with the futuristic visual background, there is definitely an impact that “AKIRA” has. Even when fighting against the Joker in “Kaneda,” there are sounds like “dadder” or voices of people mixed in, and that was really shocking. It was like, “Oh, you can do this kind of thing,” and “There are works like this.” So, in that sense, compared to simply drawing manga with just paper and pen, I realized that music and sound can create a really powerful visual experience in films and anime. It was a fundamental experience.

Sakoda

No, exactly. What I thought I wanted to talk about after this is an episode with Mr. Satoshi Kon. Just like Mr. Susumu Hirasawa, Mr. Satoshi Kon also had a hand in creating that world view. Coming into contact with such works, it feels like Mr. Matsuura is being led towards the direction of creating with animation as a visual medium.

Well, with all that said, a little while ago, we also talked about the self-produced animation that Mr. Matsuura is working on, in a timeline closer to the present. As we head towards the second half, I would like to introduce one song if possible.

Matsuura

Yes. It is a song called “凪-ganui” by a bassist named anizou-san. When I was a student, I heard it being performed on the streets of Shinjuku, and I decided to use it in my graduation project. I obtained permission from the artist to use the song. So, please have a listen.

The original experience of “Morning of the Moons” was what I thought while working as a telephone operator.

Sakoda

Anizou’s song, but when I was listening to it on the street, I couldn’t help but be captivated by the melody of the guitar, you know?

Matsuura

Oh, I see. This is also my first experience in junior high school. I was friends with a girl in the brass band club, and she told me, “You have all your musical talent in drawing, so music is not for you.” Well, she said it half jokingly, but I wasn’t really playing music myself, so I started to listen more carefully, like the relationship between the Geinō Yamashirogumi and Mr. Otomo earlier.

Brother Kura-san was playing in front of the east exit of Shinjuku, in that square before the current gap. The moment it reached my ears, I thought, “Ah, this is the person.” After he finished playing, I approached him and at that time, I was still a student, and I said, “I’m using visuals and animations in my student projects. Would you let me use your music?” We talked right there, and he said, “Oh, it’s totally fine. Please, go ahead.”

Sakoda

So, it means that you will provide music for the works titled “Moon Mornings” and “Human Droplet,” right?

Matsuura

Yes, that’s right. I used each of Brother Kura’s different songs. And while I was working on it, I listened to them all the time.

Sakoda

After all, for Mr. Matsuura, music is a big part of expanding his work or rather, it is a significant essence in creating his work. I think you can see this in the example of “Hidzukuri” that follows.

Matsuura

Well, that’s true. Even our respected Mr. Oshii says, “Half of the movie is music.”

Sakoda

Yeah, that’s right. It’s the same with Mr. Oshii’s story, and Mr. Kon’s story as well. When talking about Mr. Matsuura’s life, there are definitely various encounters with different people, and I really want to hear about how he interpreted their words and digested them.

One thing I notice about Mr. Matsuura is that he really values the encounters and connections with people. Not just the finished works, but also the episodes with the people who participated together, it’s great that those things are being properly recorded and expressed in some form of writing. I think it’s really wonderful.

Matsuura

Ah, I am honored. Thank you very much.

Sakoda

Of course, anime is something that involves various people, and it’s impossible to know everyone involved in every part. However, I really feel this strong desire to shine a spotlight on the people who have worked together with me or supported me, at least within my own circle. I think it’s wonderful that this feeling comes across.

“Tsuki-tachi no Asa” and “Hito Shizuku” are works from Matsura-san’s university days. I think during that time, there are many people who want to create works but are unable to fully accomplish it. I’m curious, what motivated you during those times?

Matsuura

Motivation… Well, I think it’s like showing off a toy and saying, “Isn’t this interesting? What do you think?” when you find something that you personally find fascinating. That’s still somewhat similar to what I’m doing now, even in my current job. You know, sometimes there are things that I think only I know in the whole universe. When I thought that maybe I’m the only one who realized, “Oh, is this what it means?” there are times when I say to someone, “Hey, hey, I noticed something and felt this way, what do you think?” and they respond with, “Yeah, that’s great!” There are also times when they say, “Oh, actually, I noticed that too.” You know, sometimes when I come across other creators or works and think, “Ah, this person noticed the same thing as me,” that also becomes my motivation. Is that what motivation is, I wonder?

Sakoda

When there is something that only I know or a new idea that comes from within me, the easiest way to express it is usually through “words,” right? Well, I think that “words” have the advantage of being a means of expression that can be used in a variety of ways, but there are moments when the resolution suddenly decreases when you try to put it into words. So, by turning it into anime, illustrations, or manga, I think it’s possible to maintain that resolution as much as possible and express it to the world. From that perspective, I wonder if anime as a medium makes it easier to showcase such expressions.

Matsuura

I have a story from when I was working part-time as a telephone operator. At that time, the hourly wage was pretty good, and it was during the era of ADSL internet. So, I was working as a telephone operator, making calls to sell products. Because many art students tend to be shy and introverted, I thought it would be a good opportunity to improve my communication skills, and I also had some ulterior motives. While working that job, there was a row of call centers where I would continuously make phone calls. However, most of the time, no one would answer, so I would repeatedly make the sound of dialing and hang up with a click. And during that time, I started to wonder, “Where is this vibrating sound coming from?” It gave me a strange sensation.

I had the experience of just waiting while continuously making phone calls and not getting through to anyone. And as I kept hearing this sound, I started to imagine a picture of myself floating alone in a vast space, like I was in some kind of wide universe. I thought, “Oh, if I could capture this feeling in a visual form, it would be beautiful and interesting.” And that’s how it led to the creation of “Morning of the Moons” during my third year of university.

Sakoda

That’s exactly it, isn’t it? It’s hard to grasp, like the sensation of a moment, even if you try to express it with all your might, it feels “wrong,” like the resolution has dropped significantly and it’s just not it. But for those who can create it in anime or place it on a timeline, I imagine they can get pretty close to that feeling.

As a visual producer, I don’t draw my own pictures, so I think it would be nice to have that ability to directly output my intuition or imagination.