Guest, Personality

Guest: Masashi Kimura from Room6

Born in 1972, currently 50 years old. After graduating from a computer specialized school, he aimed to work in the gaming industry but ended up becoming a business engineer. In 2010, he started his own business with the desire to develop iPhone applications, inspired by the release of the iPhone in 2007. He realized that game development could also be done on the iPhone and started developing smartphone games around 2013.

From around 2015, he has participated in many indie game events both domestically and internationally. Around 2017, he started developing console games for Nintendo Switch. In 2019, he began working as an indie game publisher through connections with developers he met at events. In 2020, he started operating the indie game label “Yokaze” which collects games from around the world.

Personality: Yuuki Sakoda

After working for a telecommunications company and a comprehensive advertising agency, he started an anime planning and production company and produces music videos and films. In 2021, he moved to Kyoto and started working on promoting the entertainment industry in Kyoto. He is currently also working in the entertainment field of manga and audio. He is planning and producing audio dramas and webtoons. In addition, he serves as a producer and advisor for multiple entertainment companies.

Table of Contents

#01

• Student days aiming for the gaming industry…
• Daily life of a business systems engineer
• The reawakening of passion for games with the advent of the iPhone
• Interview with Taiyo Shiiba, the composer for “world for two”
• The importance of music in indie games
• The significance of music, scenarios, graphics, and game systems

#02

• From various life events to starting an independent business
• Motivation for game development accelerated by participating in indie game events
• The charming office in Demachiyanagi, Kyoto
• Games and monetization
• The nourishment received from anime during tough times
• The final push to make games more enjoyable
• The importance of test players and the difficulty of judgment

#03

• While video media is a linear format, games are…
• Games with interactive elements are the pinnacle of complex systems
• What Room6 and Yokaze Label want to provide based on this understanding
• Meeting Hako Seikatsu at a pixel art event
• Starting the publishing business in 2019
• Creating game works as if they were one’s own children
• The development of Phantom AP advanced well with excellent collaboration among creators
• The latest work will be released when it is completed

Games with interactive elements are the extreme of complexity systems.

Sakoda

I was thinking that it might be easier to understand if I compare and contrast it with anime. In the case of anime, it is basically a passive medium where the entire episode is created by producing scenarios and audiovisuals and then presenting it in a time sequence for the viewer to watch. Because it is watched in a linear progression, it can be viewed in a passive and relaxed attitude. On the other hand, games have interactivity and there are both passive and active moments. Also, because we have to design experiences that players can enjoy by playing, the way we feel about the game is different for each person and also varies depending on the game system. Therefore, I feel that it requires imagination and is very difficult.

Kimura

That’s right. I think there might already be a point where it’s like the pinnacle of complexity.

Sakoda

That’s right. If there are only four types of human types and you can understand everything by testing them on those four types, the story would be simple. But there are still various people with different perceptions, and in that world, the worldview of Room 6 and the “Yokaze” label, which is a stable brand, is my guess that they have narrowed down what the people who play here are looking for and the audience they want to reach. “Unreal Life”, “Phantom AP”, “ghostpia”, and “World for Two” are also like that. If Mr. Kimura can see who they want to reach, how can he articulate it if he can see it hypothetically?

What Yokaze Label wants to offer in room 6:

Kimura

Yes, that’s right. What I’m currently doing is the indie game label “Yokaze”. Our goal is to gather games that can immerse players in a world and release them. It’s a bit vague, but as you mentioned earlier, the important thing is to narrow down and gather games that we like and deliver them to fans. The title you mentioned earlier was “Unreal Life”, which was started with the author Hako Seikatsu in 2019. I met Hako Seikatsu at an art event and asked if we could work together.

Sakoda

Oh, it’s already turned into an art event, isn’t it?

Kimura

Well, yes, sometimes you can meet people and become friends there. It was a time when subcultures, quiet with a story, and stylish pixel art games were becoming popular. It was around the time when we started making “Unreal Life” and when stylish indie games were becoming accepted. We decided to go in that direction and unify it under a label.

We started an indie game publishing business in 2019. It’s a business where we not only develop games but also sell games from other developers through room6. However, when we started, we didn’t have a clear idea of what kind of brand we wanted to create or what we wanted to sell, so I personally was struggling with it. I didn’t want to just find and sell any game, as I didn’t think that was interesting or sustainable. However, meeting hako-seikatsu-kun was perfect timing, and it felt like the puzzle pieces just fit together. He also wanted us to sell his game, but he wanted it to be featured in a select shop rather than just being one of many games in the same place. Our thoughts aligned perfectly, and that’s how we created an indie game label.

Sakoda

Ah, I see. By meeting hako life, you were able to clarify the target audience you want to reach with “Yokaze”, right?

Kimura

Well, let’s see. I somehow realized that there are quite a lot of fans who like this kind of game, and not just “Unreal Life”, but around that time there was a game called “From_.” and there was also an offer to play “Hateno Makina” together, since all three games were pixel art, the four of us decided to launch it. It feels like we gathered together nicely.

Sakoda

I see, so these two were the ones who added color and direction to the art and world view of “Yokaze” with what this member was creating.

Kimura

Well, for me, it was like gathering people around with the idea that the title was attractive enough and that we could make it work, and creating the opportunity for it. Yes.

Sakoda

I see. In today’s world where there is an abundance of content, not only for indie games but also for anime and manga, there is talk of competition between works not only within the industry but also across industries, almost as if they are competing for time and attention. In such a situation where there is a lot of content to choose from, it is important to have a select shop so that consumers do not waste their time.

When I myself wanted to start making indie games, I was able to do so because there was the “Yokaze” label. I thought that if I played the games from “Yokaze,” I would not fail. By the way, what kind of customers does “Yokaze” want to reach?

Kimura

Well, let me see. I’m not sure…but I think there are more young people. Most likely, there are a lot of people in their 20s. Well, if I say that, I might get scolded by people in their 30s, but I still think that there are more people with a young sense. What do you think? Well, looking at the fans, there are also many stylish people. Pixel art is said to be retro style, but I think there are also new expressions mixed in, so I think there are many people who are sensitive and interested in new expressions.

Sakoda

Conversely, there are young people who feel freshness in that retro style.

I think there’s something like a repetition of those times, like with city pop or Showa retro coming back in music.

In the latter half, I’d like to talk a bit about my work as a publisher that I briefly mentioned earlier, and also touch on “Yokaze”. But for now, I’d like to share a song with you here.

Kimura

Yes. Um, the song I want is Sayuri’s “Hanauta”. Thank you.

Create game works with as much care as you would for your own child.

Sakoda

What is the backstory behind this song?

Kimura

Well, this is the ending song of an anime called “Rikorisu Rikoilu” that aired last year. Personally, I think it’s one of the best songs from the anime I’ve heard recently. The anime itself is also interesting, and it’s a work that I watched quite a bit.

Sakoda

No, we have been hearing about Mr. Kimura’s career and delving into the secrets of the world view of things created by Room6 and the “Yokaze” label. Mr. Harada, who has been listening to us, do you have any questions at this point?

Harada

Well, let me see. Sorry to bother you. Thank you for talking to me about various things. As someone who works on the anime side, there are parts that I feel are quite close, but when it comes to pushing the balance of the game to the limit at the end, it’s a matter of which opinion to take. I think it’s something that applies to all aspects of creation. The more you think about it, the more the plan or axis may waver, and it may be important not to stray from it. Or maybe it’s important to jump on a different direction. So, I was thinking about whether games are being made with such judgments in this infinite and complex system. I thought that Mr. Kimura was involved in it as a director at that time, and I was listening to him saying “I see, I see.”

After that, when it comes to the label, the producer-like movements suddenly increase, so I would like to know a little about how Mr. Kimura distinguishes between himself as a director and as a producer.

Kimura

Oh, I see. Well, you really feel like a producer now. It seems that more and more directors are leaving it up to the creators to handle. However, when it comes to the final decision, I do speak up, but for the most part, as a producer, I’m starting to rely on the creators’ instincts.

Harada

If that’s the case, then it seems like it will fall on Mr. Kimura’s shoulders to gather titles that have a certain worldview or direction, like a discerning eye or line drawing. It’s like he’ll have to be selective.

Kimura

That’s right. Well, it’s not just me making the decisions, but basically in the end, we make the decisions together with Hako Seikatsu-kun. It’s a combination of his discerning eye, my discerning eye, and of course, listening to the opinions of other staff members. We have a somewhat consensual system, but we try to stick to the brand’s direction as much as possible because it’s not good to deviate too much from the overall concept. It’s like trying not to stray too far from the framework.

Harada

Well, what bothers me in situations like this is whether it’s the perspective of the work or the perspective of the creator. Do game creators sometimes create different things depending on the situation?

Kimura

Well, certainly for now, I’m not working with the same creator on multiple projects. However, I really want to continue working with that creator. Their atmosphere and worldview don’t change suddenly, and their gag style won’t change, so I think I’ll mostly be working with that creator. Yes.

Sakoda

Something that I think about when I listen is that when it comes to creators who are driving the label’s worldview and moving forward, the majority of the people they want to reach are creators who are similar. Even among those creators they want to reach, not all of them are making games, some are pursuing other forms of creation. However, it seems that those who are creating things overwhelmingly resonate with the label’s message. This is because the creators are able to empathize with each other and move forward in a creator-driven manner.

Kimura

Well, I see. It’s exactly like that, nowadays it’s important to know who is making indie games, or rather, people are really paying attention to that, so we’re quite conscious of it.

Sakoda

Mmm, and I also think that for the creator, there are various factors such as the company or team they work with when creating something. But you can tell whether they value their own work or not, right? So, I believe that being able to see whether the end product was made with care or not will be important for the label or company going forward.

The development of Phantom AP has progressed remarkably well thanks to the creators’ collaborative efforts.

Sakoda

When I played “Phantom AP,” I felt that it was an excellent work created by a talented creator, and I could sense the respect for the work that the creator had made. As Kimura-san has also mentioned, I think it is important for creators who create labels to cherish their works like their own children. I was surprised by the quality of this work, which can be played for free.

Kimura

Well, this game has changed quite a bit since its launch. Originally, the plan was to create a game based on the world view of an artist named Harumaki Gohan, but we didn’t just want to make a game simply because we were asked to do so. We wanted to create a game where creators could work together, so Hoko Seikatsu-kun, Ozumikan-kun, and our staff worked together on the development. When creators work together, they sometimes argue or things don’t go well, but in this development, communication worked well and we were able to progress without any fights. The development period was about four months, but even for a small game that would be difficult to complete during that time, we were able to achieve ideal development. Even now, this development is one of our landmarks, and we believe that this is the best way to create something like this.

Sakoda

Oh, I see. The atmosphere definitely came across. There was a sense that everyone was enjoying themselves. “Gensou AP” has a certain charm due to its world-building and volume, and it feels just right. Even though the game is ending, there may be other opportunities for merchandising or other developments that allow fans to enjoy the entire universe. Additionally, hearing about the incredible collaboration among creators makes me think it’s really great. It’s like aiming for this kind of success.

Kimura

It was a really great development. It was true that the members of the team were originally close, and I think it went really well, including that. The worldview of Harumaki Gohan was wonderful, and the music was also amazing.

When the latest work is completed, it is time to release it.

Sakoda

Well, I was hoping to hear more about “ghostpia” in this discussion thread, but since it’s taking too much time, I reluctantly have to give up on that. What I really want to know is when will works like “World for Two,” “Unreal Life,” “From_,” “Hate no Makina,” and “Kitsune to Kaeru” be released? These are the works that I’m personally interested in.

Kimura

Yes, that’s right. Well, honestly, I don’t really know, but it’s like releasing it when it’s done.

Sakoda

Well, listening to the earlier conversation, it does seem to be the case.

Kimura

Well, as a rough framework, we’d like to release “Fox and Frog” next year. Of course, we’ve set that goal and we don’t want to keep making it indefinitely, thinking we can do it anytime, so that’s not good. However, we plan to release it within six months to a year from now. I think we’ll probably be able to release the game we received this time next year.

Sakoda

I see. However, it’s difficult. Without setting a deadline, it’s hard to keep track of the collection. But there isn’t a particularly compelling reason to set a deadline, so…

Kimura

That’s right, in the end we have to make an interesting game. We don’t do contract development anymore, but in that line of work, you have to commit to deadlines, right? Well, when it comes to that, you inevitably have to cut content or throw something away, so personally, I’m producing games now with a policy of not committing to deadlines.

Sakoda

Oh, I see. I think I understood a little about the elements that make up the world of “Yokaze” after listening to your talk earlier. It was very helpful to understand the attitude with which it was created from the story of the central members. I have one question at the end, though. You mentioned the four pillars: music, scenario, game system, and graphics. I think music and graphics contribute to creating the world, and scenario is also important. Is the game system relatively less important among them?

Kimura

Well, let’s see. The game system is probably the one that is least developed among these. It might be the game system.

Sakoda

That’s right, isn’t it? If you had to choose, which element do you think is the most important to pay attention to?

Kimura

It’s difficult, isn’t it? Well, what can be said is that game systems have certainly been considered important since ancient times. Especially in Japan. However, I think it’s not just about the system, there are other important elements in games, and the games we are creating can impress people not only with new systems, but also with well-polished systems. I don’t think everyone is looking for new systems, so we also want to put effort into graphics, music, and scenarios.

Sakoda

I see. I’m glad we were able to get a little closer to the secrets of “Yokaze” and room6’s production today. If there is any kind of announcement or something to be revealed at the end…

Kimura

Well, let me see. In the near future, the Steam version of the visual novel game “ghostpia” is scheduled to be released in August. Also, on August 24th, a packaged version of “Unreal Life” will be released. Since only the download version has been sold so far, we plan to release a packaged version as a physical media. It is currently available for pre-order and can be reserved on online shopping sites such as Amazon. Please check it out.

Sakoda

Is there something about the package version of “Unreal Life” that makes you want to buy the package, like a special gimmick or something?

Kimura

Well, the packaged version of “Unreal Life” comes with the original comic. Additionally, the limited edition includes a disc with music, featuring impressive tracks like newly re-recorded songs and collaborations between the virtual singers ISEKAIJOUCHO and Harumaki Gohan. These are definitely worth listening to and watching.

Sakoda

When it comes to ISEKAIJOUCHO and Harumaki Gohan, their tag on YouTube’s “Yokaze Night” is really great, isn’t it?

Kimura

Well, you know, it’s really fun and I think it’s a great thing that creators like us are working together to create something like this, and it’s producing good results. So, I think this effort is kind of the right answer. Yes.